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Come On Boris

don't let us down.

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Female
Gilpin  Female  Middlesex
10-Dec-2020 21:35 Message #4800356
Don't allow them any laws that control British supremacy. Don't let us be tied to their regulations. They know, we are going to be their biggest competitor, don't let them stop our industry.

Or you party is stuffed, and will not win the next election. You should not have gone to Brussels. They'll put something in your drink! just joking. Mrs. M was putty everytime she went over.
Male
Beach  Male  Dorset
10-Dec-2020 22:08 Message #4800359
Oven ready? :)
Female
Gilpin  Female  Middlesex
10-Dec-2020 22:46 Message #4800362
By the looks of it, we ain't getting the oven ready.

No deal, according to Boris, while looking cheery. Play the EU at their own game.
Male
Pboro Trevor  Male  Cambridgeshire
11-Dec-2020 09:32 Message #4800385
Indeed Gilpin. The EU have failed to recognise that we will be a sovereign nation, and want to keep us tied to their apron strings

Trevor
Female
Gilpin  Female  Middlesex
11-Dec-2020 10:42 Message #4800395
Or even their chariot wheels.

No deal is looking likely. Say both parties. How long do you hold your nerve. How badly do they want our waters, or rather they are happy for us to have sovreignty of our waters, just not the fish!

Such an interesting situation. Still wonder if there will be a deal.
Female
leogirl  Female  Essex
11-Dec-2020 15:19 Message #4800423
I wonder if Britain`s sovreignty will not cost the Brits a vast amount of money that we all have to pay for in taxes and loss of earnings/pensions etc. And the loss of a lifestyle that we have become used to.
Time will tell … but have you noticed how much the little bag of shopping cost you? Will you now be able to afford the holidays abroad? Will the hordes of Brits living and working abroad come back to this country ?
What if Schotland started to spit from the U.K? will Schotland be respected to have the pluck to go it alone?
What I also found out.... if I try to talk about those issues to staunch Brexiteers the answers is usually " don`t worry about it! "
I don`t claim to have the answers on this questions and leave others to debate it .
Male
Kimjongun  Male  South Yorkshire
11-Dec-2020 17:01 Message #4800432
I am sure Scotland proud of Boris.
Just like we all are, we need good leader at moments like this.
Personally I send Churchill, Oh yessss!
Female
NoSaint  Female  Devon
11-Dec-2020 17:29 Message #4800439
Boris has fought to achieve the wish of the British voter but the EU might scupper any desirable deal so we will have to go it alone - as voted for.
Female
Gilpin  Female  Middlesex
11-Dec-2020 18:52 Message #4800448
leogirl

It won't be a smooth transition, and there are sure to be some bumps until everything is organised, as with any big move.

Trade agreements or lack of are are not in place yet, there shouldn't be any Brexit related effect on food prices at the moment.

This is what they think might be effected.

Taken from the Metro today.

"Pork, bacon and beef – slightly more expensive bacon is a possibility in the event of a ‘no-deal’ scenario.

Fresh chicken – tariffs could reach 12p per chicken, according to Which? That doesn’t necessarily mean customers will pay 12p extra, though.

Even if a deal IS agreed, it’s highly unlikely any prices on EU food products will drop. The London School of Economics estimates that with a variety of other costs adding up, there’ll be a 4.7% price rise on unbranded products from the EU. That said, as new trade deals with non-EU countries roll in, anything could happen."


We cannot have Europe dictate to us how to live, influence and change the laws of this country. Have precedence or control of the democratic vote. If they were more, trustworthy, it would not matter. They are empire building, they admit it. We would be a vassal state of very little importance, despite being one of the largest economies. And whatever rule they apply we will have to obey.
Male
Maglorian  Male  North Yorkshire
12-Dec-2020 22:31 Message #4800560
A Dead Statesman - Rudyard Kipling.

I could not dig: I dared not rob:

Therefore I lied to please the mob.

Now all my lies are proved untrue.

And I must face the men I slew.

What tale shall serve me here among.

Mine angry and defrauded young.
Male
BrexitBob  Male  Oxfordshire
12-Dec-2020 22:40 Message #4800562
We cannot have Europe dictate to us how to live, influence and change the laws of this country. Have precedence or control of the democratic vote. If they were more, trustworthy, it would not matter. They are empire building, they admit it. We would be a vassal state of very little importance, despite being one of the largest economies. And whatever rule they apply we will have to obey.

The democratic vote says leaving is the only option.
Female
Gilpin  Female  Middlesex
13-Dec-2020 20:54 Message #4800649
Well, Brexit talks extended, yet again. Will it make a difference?
Female
Gilpin  Female  Middlesex
13-Dec-2020 21:24 Message #4800650
Mags.

to the last stanza of Kipling.

Should one forget the Jean Monet chair, in European integration, introduced into our higher education institutions, and earmarked at the youth of this country, with a purpose to mentor their thinking, and to influence impressionable young minds, towards the Union.
We have never had that sort of direction in politics in our universities before.

Perhaps your generation? ... :)
Male
Maglorian  Male  North Yorkshire
13-Dec-2020 23:10 Message #4800669
Gilpin.

Have not Impressionable young minds always been the potential to control and brainwash? The Catholic church with their army of Jesuit schooling. The Eton schools self fulfilling privilege mantra. The Brexit Nationalist bugle, of "take back control!". The Green Monet Chair is just another game of influence and manipulation.

I feel alignment in the saying of Mark Twain: "I never let schooling interfere with my education"

Male
Maglorian  Male  North Yorkshire
13-Dec-2020 23:24 Message #4800670
I missed a "my" out. "I never let my schooling, interfere with my education".

Must be my education that made that error ;)
Female
Gilpin  Female  Middlesex
14-Dec-2020 15:51 Message #4800706
Mags Mags Religion is not the same.

Eton is definitely not on a par with, if I may say, tradesmen on the make. Politics is serious stuff, and should not be messed about with, you could end up with another attempt at the Third Empire, not so distant in their history. All power would be centralized in Brussels, that was/is the aim, and made into law. It's the way it was heading. Trade is merely a fat carrot.
Female
Gilpin  Female  Middlesex
15-Dec-2020 15:41 Message #4800795
December 31st is the final deadline. They cannot take it further than that. I wonder what they are doing.

They don't want to lose the 2nd largest economy in their EU, unless France has caught up, then we're 3rd. We lose the single market. Bit of a tough one.
Male
BrexitBob  Male  Oxfordshire
15-Dec-2020 15:57 Message #4800797
It's not only a case of what each party wants but what each party can afford to concede in the eyes of their people.
Female
Gilpin  Female  Middlesex
15-Dec-2020 16:21 Message #4800802
Boris can concede nothing, that does not involve sovreignty, and his resultant demise.

The EU's poison carrot, of 'we have the largest single market in the world', as von de Lyon keeps repeating, is not going to be such an easy entrapment.
Male
Maglorian  Male  North Yorkshire
15-Dec-2020 17:54 Message #4800806
Gilpin.

Do you suppose a deal will be reached? and, what is your standing relating to the No Deal-De Regulation agenda, that stirs deep in the materialist minds, of the Tory Hard Right MP's and their Corporate controllers? Do you prefer We'll show them!, No-deal De-regulate? Or, There are no problems, only solutions, a more mature and wise approach, that fosters compromise and reason and doesn't resort to cunning, by playing the Jingo Bingo game.

Eton indoctrination begins from the Nanny's involvement of the open to influence ready child. The poor little souls then go on to become fledgling ruling class, with self importance and confidence abound & churning out charming sociopaths, who read from the book of lies. Comparing a tradesman to an Etonian's accumulation of wealth, fairly verses unfairly. Is a debate requiring another thread.

Deregulation is all about undercutting costs, to be more competitive in the market. Labour, the personal activity of man, being one element of cutting. The subject of labour: the thing worked on, and the instruments of labour: tools, are the others. Cheaper commodities and raw materials are less easy to reduce in costs, due to commodity fetishism and availability. So the workers wages are always the first to be cut, to ensure profit maximization and better competition.

Maybe to balance the burden, the baby boomers who voted in this act of patriotic division, should forfeit the standard of living fall, that economists and political analysts predict will occur on the younger generations. By a show of appreciation, for the suffering the youth will endure & paying a levy from their pensions and savings, as some form of Brex-Divy. It would only be right and moral, to shelter the next generation from the grave consequences of Idealism. But it could also be classed as ageism.
Male
BrexitBob  Male  Oxfordshire
15-Dec-2020 18:00 Message #4800809
Pointing at the Tories/hard right/corporate controllers etc is really a load of tosh because we know very well that an enormous number of Labour ministers and supporters were desperate for Brexit and I'm sure many will recall Labour blaming their losing the election on the fact so many of their numbers voted with the Tories to ensure the democratic decision of the country to leave the EU would not be reneged on.

Brexit is very much Brexit not a petty political squabble or attempt to score points.
Female
JustLyn  Female  Cheshire
15-Dec-2020 18:03 Message #4800810
Subjective opinion from readings in past couple years.

I'm not posting links on everything to "prove" anything, you can look it up yourself.

I recall an audit showing how there is an increase in young people doing degree level studies, and the reason degree level nursing was introduced, was to create nurses who question practice, not blindly believe everything they are told. Also to read and interpret research and not be taken in by fake news as it seems to be called today.

My degree wasn't a nursing degree, but it still incorporated not succumbing to "brainwashing" and believing what seems obvious at first sight.

So if you extrapolate this into the increase in young voters having more insight into questioning their tutors, it turned out more educated voted Labour and more educated voted Remain.
I'll post just one link.

https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/labour-mp-is-right-better-educated-people-more-likely-to-vote-remain

Just using nursing as an example and being an "oldie" in a "newbie" wrapper, no, the other way round.. I kind of worked amidst the ones who trained in nursing with me, who were for example, influenced as the public were into, for example, the myths of the flu vaccine. Whereas, the degree level younger nurses, and older ones like me who "upgraded", were more discerning in seeking out latest evidence and peer review on published research.

So I don't think the educated youth of today are easily taken in any more than older people who are more keen to read sources they already politically align with that reinforces what they have been brought up to believe.
Female
Gilpin  Female  Middlesex
15-Dec-2020 19:15 Message #4800812
Mags

To me it's about upholding democracy before the allowing of materialistic gain/greed and corporate power having influence in politics. About the ending of supremacy of EU law within the UK. The worrying political ambitions of the EU.

This country will bounce back, there has never been an occasion when it hasn't. I don't find the EU to have the integrity of a democratically run governing body. The Commission appears to have ultimate power, over E. parliament, their members appear to be voted in by the Council. It is all rather complex, not straight forward, and open to abuse imo.

We cannot cater to the youth, just for the sake of it. Predictions made by economists and political analysts can be influenced.

Baby boomers have spent 40 working years achieving their standard of living. Why should they have to give it away to those who have not worked 5 years.

Some institutions, like Eton etc. have a history and tradition. I think you would have to get rid of the monarchy if you wanted to change that.
Male
ShavedFish  Male  Merseyside
15-Dec-2020 21:02 Message #4800816
Gilpin, the country may bounce back. But on the backs of the struggling, Zero hours, Universal Credit top up dependent youth. I fully understand your legitimacy concerns around transparency and proper democracy. As I do back here in our monarchy marbled House of Commons.

JustLyn nailed it, by revealing the critical thinking generation evolvement train, coming happily down the track. I actually feel pity for the Monarchy and all it's grovelling entrails. I wouldn't dream of getting rid. Removing them would destroy a lot of peoples lives. Change is already with us.

I think it's all down to semantics. The basic tool for the manipulation of reality, is the manipulation of words. If you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use the words.

If you get my meaning your honor ))
Female
NoSaint  Female  Devon
15-Dec-2020 21:35 Message #4800817
BrexitBob Male Oxfordshire
15-Dec-2020 18:00 new Message #4800809
Pointing at the Tories/hard right/corporate controllers etc is really a load of tosh because we know very well that an enormous number of Labour ministers and supporters were desperate for Brexit and I'm sure many will recall Labour blaming their losing the election on the fact so many of their numbers voted with the Tories to ensure the democratic decision of the country to leave the EU would not be reneged on.

Brexit is very much Brexit not a petty political squabble or attempt to score points.


Correct.

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