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The British are only 'part-time Europeans', says Jean-Claude Juncker

Jean-Claude Juncker is spot on...

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Male
Michaelt  Male  Devon 14-Sep-2019 10:04 Message #4752486
Britain has never been fully in a Social Europe enjoying the benefits of the EU Social Charter.

We have only ever been on the periphery of Europe, not able to get involved in decision making, not having the Euro'.

I want the next government, be it Labour, Lib-Dem, or a Labour lead coalition with the Lib-Dems, or a Lib-Dem pro-European Government, to take us fully into the European Community giving us the benefits of the EU Social Charter, workers rights, higher unemployment benefits ect, and a currency change to the Euro..

Your thoughts please. ?
Male
NotHermit  Male  Derbyshire 14-Sep-2019 10:25 Message #4752489
The Euro?
I am genuinely worried about you michaelt.
We really missed out with the Euro didn't we?

Now you need a hobby to occupy yourself.
A proper hobby, not posting nonsense all the time.

Per your preference of government.

Be careful what you wish for.
Male
Hierophant  Male  East Anglia 14-Sep-2019 10:29 Message #4752490
He's right, you're wrong...
Male
Michaelt  Male  Devon 14-Sep-2019 10:45 Message #4752497
NotHermit, No need to worry about me. I never post nonsense.
Male
Good2BWith  Male  West Yorkshire 14-Sep-2019 10:52 Message #4752498
NotHermit 14-Sep-2019 10:25
It's Tiffin Time, I logged in and saw a really juicy and highly relevant contemporary subject.
Thinking that I'd read the opinions so far I saw that the first (And as I'm typing) and only reply was from "NotHermit".
Apart from the words "The Euro" the posting contained nothing of relevance to the subject which may be uppermost when the country decides to Remain and votes in a Labour administration.

I'm treated to a # of paragraphs of personal abuse and attempted derision of the OP. Posted not as a response to an attack from the OP - but as the FIRST response to a reasonable and rational Thread starter.

Many may disagree with the OP's stance on a number of issues, tho probably fewer than those who HATE mine.

However, is not the way to counter such opinions via rational, evidence-based, referenced discussion rather than postings containing nothing but ad hominem abuse?
Male
Witheflow  Male  North Yorkshire 14-Sep-2019 11:16 Message #4752504
That's a good idea Michael. In the forthcoming General Election, Real Labours Manifesto is proposing a referendum on Remain; Brexit with a deal and the Tory Wrecksit option. SO maybe a Full Union* option should be added.
Male
Good2BWith  Male  West Yorkshire 14-Sep-2019 11:17 Message #4752505
Michaelt 14-Sep-2019 10:04

Britain has never been fully in a Social Europe enjoying the benefits of the EU Social Charter.

We have only ever been on the periphery of Europe, not able to get involved in decision making, not having the Euro'.

I want the next government, be it Labour, Lib-Dem, or a Labour lead coalition with the Lib-Dems, or a Lib-Dem pro-European Government, to take us fully into the European Community giving us the benefits of the EU Social Charter, workers rights, higher unemployment benefits ect, and a currency change to the Euro..

Your thoughts please. ?
---------------------------
A really relevant Thread which has caused me to don my post-Tiffin Thinking Cap.

When UK decides to Remain and we vote in Labour with a substantial majority, UK will be under pressure to join the Euro to show that we really are committed to full and meaningful membership of the EU.

Should we carry on over the economic and societal cliff of Leaving, then, in but a few years, we will be back knocking for re-entry.
There is no doubt that will only be allowed after long and onerous negotiations. One of the conditions will be that UK does join the Euro.

However, I'm somewhat puzzled as to which aspects of the EU Social Charter we're missing out at the moment.
I was under the impression that the benefits of the EU Social Charter, workers rights, higher unemployment benefits etc, which I thought we have, were part of the reason that the market-obsessed, neo-liberal profit greedy backers of the shambolic Brexit=Tory party are so determined to Leave so they could destroy those rights?
Male
Good2BWith  Male  West Yorkshire 14-Sep-2019 11:20 Message #4752506
Hierophant 14-Sep-2019 10:29
He's right, you're wrong...


WHO?
Male
Seasons-Greetings  Male  Essex 14-Sep-2019 11:33 Message #4752511
It's no surprise that J-C Juncker comes out with that sorta 5h1t.
Maybe he thinks he's been sent from above to be new "JC" to lead us all to salvation.
It's no secret that the experiences of his family during the war had a profound influence in shaping his views on the need for European intergration.
Also he's from a land locked speck within the land mass that is Europe so no surprise that he doesn't understand what being an "Islander" means to identity.
Well, we, Britain and it's Commonwealth, weren't so part-time that we couldn't save his countrymen and most of the rest of Western Europe, TWICE, from the horrors of the 3rd Reich and old Kaiser Bill.
The Euro is a doomed experiment, that only the Fatherland ever wanted. Many of the initial countries tied to it (like Italy, Greece, Portugal, Spain, and some of the newer adoptees like Malta & Cyprus (who had no option but to convert to receive access to the EU kitty) now have no option but to remain so, as they're in hock up to their eyeballs and beyond.
Male
Witheflow  Male  North Yorkshire 14-Sep-2019 11:47 Message #4752512
OnlineMSE. Where do i start amongst that Jingoistic bull bab? My advice is, go and enjoy a cheap weatherspoons pint and pie mate.

A song that may rattle your Jingoism.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V4CPezSV198
Male
Good2BWith  Male  West Yorkshire 14-Sep-2019 14:04 Message #4752518
@Witheflow 14-Sep-2019 11:47

Just you wait until the

Black Swan

is unfurled
Male
Witheflow  Male  North Yorkshire 14-Sep-2019 14:12 Message #4752519
"rara avis in terris nigroque simillima cygno" The undoing of the logic of any system of thought, as well as any reasoning that followed from that underlying logic. I feel we are in that presence already Good2Bwith. Only pride and ignorance, keeps some gnashing at the pointless bit now.
Male
Good2BWith  Male  West Yorkshire 14-Sep-2019 14:22 Message #4752520
I don't know what the Country equivalent to ad hominem is (Yet), but these figures may prove 'interesting'?
All data from the IMF.

Luxenburg (Country)

GDP (PPP) 2019 estimate
Total = $70.926 billion
Per capita = $114,825 (2nd in the world - IMF)

GDP (nominal) 2019 estimate
Total = $77.436 billion
Per capita = $125,364 (1st)

The corresponding (IMF) figures for UK are:

GDP (PPP) 2019 estimate
• Total = $3.128 trillion (9th)
• Per capita = $46,781 (26th)


GDP (nominal) 2019 estimate
• Total = $2.829 trillion(6th)
• Per capita = $42,310 (20th)
Male
Good2BWith  Male  West Yorkshire 14-Sep-2019 14:39 Message #4752522
@ Witheflow 14-Sep-2019 14:12

Ah.
Taleb

Post hoc rationalizations.
"Blue sky" Research beats centralized dictats.

The 'only' doubt that I'm able to raize is that his work was praized by that fraud and band-wagon jumper
Bryan Appleyard.

Male
Neros1954  Male  Devon 14-Sep-2019 14:56 Message #4752523
OnlineMSE Male Essex 14-Sep-2019 11:33 new Message #4752511
It's no surprise that J-C Juncker comes out with that sorta 5h1t.
Maybe he thinks he's been sent from above to be new "JC" to lead us all to salvation.
It's no secret that the experiences of his family during the war had a profound influence in shaping his views on the need for European intergration.
Also he's from a land locked speck within the land mass that is Europe so no surprise that he doesn't understand what being an "Islander" means to identity.
Well, we, Britain and it's Commonwealth, weren't so part-time that we couldn't save his countrymen and most of the rest of Western Europe, TWICE, from the horrors of the 3rd Reich and old Kaiser Bill.
The Euro is a doomed experiment, that only the Fatherland ever wanted. Many of the initial countries tied to it (like Italy, Greece, Portugal, Spain, and some of the newer adoptees like Malta & Cyprus (who had no option but to convert to receive access to the EU kitty) now have no option but to remain so, as they're in hock up to their eyeballs and beyond.


Thank you for your contribution to the thread. It’s good to see a well reasoned post showing a bit of sanity.
Male
Witheflow  Male  North Yorkshire 14-Sep-2019 18:20 Message #4752551
Labour's Brexit policy

Labour's Brexit strategy really isn't that difficult to understand. Here it is again:
1. Prevent Tory No Deal chaos and economic ruination.
2. Remove the Tories who created all this Brexit chaos in the first place from power.
3. Renegotiate the Withdrawal Agreement Customs Union, Single Market access, no border in Ireland, protection of workers' rights, cooperation on environment, science, and security
4. Put the renegotiated deal to a confirmatory referendum with remain as an option, meaning that there are sensible non-meltdown options on either side.
Male
Good2BWith  Male  West Yorkshire 14-Sep-2019 18:48 Message #4752554
Witheflow 14-Sep-2019 18:20

I can appreciate that Tactic.
I'd prefer to be inside the tent, with a Democratic-Socialist vote to counter the Falangist elements which the Yankees forced on the EU.

The Ruskies must be hugging themselves with glee now they've got shot of that bunch of reactionary, racist, homophobic, misogynist, god-bothers that the EU and NATO have to put up with.
No wonder there are so many Poles who want to stay in UK rather than go back to Poland - it's even more Right-wing than Mr Johnson's position is at the moment.
Male
MrQuiet  Male  Northamptonshire 14-Sep-2019 19:45 Message #4752568
Onlinemse. It's no surprise that J-C Juncker comes out with that sorta 5h1t.
Maybe he thinks he's been sent from above to be new "JC" to lead us all to salvation.
It's no secret that the experiences of his family during the war had a profound influence in shaping his views on the need for European intergration.
Also he's from a land locked speck within the land mass that is Europe so no surprise that he doesn't understand what being an "Islander" means to identity.
Well, we, Britain and it's Commonwealth, weren't so part-time that we couldn't save his countrymen and most of the rest of Western Europe, TWICE, from the horrors of the 3rd Reich and old Kaiser Bill.
The Euro is a doomed experiment, that only the Fatherland ever wanted. Many of the initial countries tied to it (like Italy, Greece, Portugal, Spain, and some of the newer adoptees like Malta & Cyprus (who had no option but to convert to receive access to the EU kitty) now have no option but to remain so, as they're in hock up to their eyeballs and beyond.


I agree with others. A good post.
Male
SQL  Male  Devon 14-Sep-2019 20:25 Message #4752575
Michaelt - 14-Sep-2019 10:04


I want the next government, be it Labour, Lib-Dem, or a Labour lead coalition with the Lib-Dems, or a Lib-Dem pro-European Government, to take us fully into the European Community giving us the benefits of the EU Social Charter, workers rights, higher unemployment benefits ect, and a currency change to the Euro..

You forgot the higher taxes, wasting about 500,000,000 euro every time they move the whole circus from Brussels to Strasbourg and then back again, unelected executives, etc., etc..

SQL
Male
Nigel_In_Devon  Male  Devon 14-Sep-2019 20:49 Message #4752577
Michaelt..."I never post nonsense."


Lol! Do you have a short memory?
Female
Victoriana11  Female  Buckinghamshire 14-Sep-2019 20:50 Message #4752578
Well, if we are only part time Europeans, why are we paying 'more than full time' membership fees then, so why the problems with us coming out and why are they so desperate to keep us in.

Michael, why dont you take a bit more notice of Heiro and NotHermit...... you might get it right for a change, and learn something.

V x
Male
Witheflow  Male  North Yorkshire 14-Sep-2019 21:27 Message #4752587
"Michael, why dont you take a bit more notice of Heiro and NotHermit...... you might get it right" Victoriana11.

Why would Michael want to get it Right Victoriana? You may swing that Brextremist way. But you can't force people to think as selfish as you deary.
Male
fosy  Male  Leicestershire 14-Sep-2019 22:21 Message #4752603
"But you can't force people to think as selfish as you deary. "

a classic quote from a troll, you couldnt make it up could you!
bet it,s hopping mad after shooting itself in the foot, then putting said foot into its fat gob...unbelievable.

and the image is ???
Male
Good2BWith  Male  West Yorkshire 14-Sep-2019 22:28 Message #4752605
SQL 14-Sep-2019 20:25, wrote:
Michaelt - 14-Sep-2019 10:04
You forgot the higher taxes, wasting about 500,000,000 euro
every time they move the whole circus from Brussels to Strasbourg and then back again, unelected executives, etc., etc..

SQL


However

Reuters - WORLD NEWS DECEMBER 3, 2017

Members of the European Parliament (MEPs) convene in Strasbourg for one week every month and in Brussels for the remainder. The monthly upheaval costs the bloc 114 million euros ($124 million) a year, EU auditors say.
Male
HotOrWot  Male  Lancashire 14-Sep-2019 22:45 Message #4752607
The Euro?
I am genuinely worried about you michaelt.
We really missed out with the Euro didn't we?

Now you need a hobby to occupy yourself.
A proper hobby, not posting nonsense all the time.

Per your preference of government.

Be careful what you wish for.


Exactly.

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