Conversation Religion and Spirituality
Helper icon Helpers: Chris2mates , LLstill , PrincessFruitBat

About us

Midsummer's Eve is a free online dating community - based around friendship, real meetups, real people, and real relationships. We've been online since 1999 and have twice won Radio 2's Web Site of the Day award. So why not join us for free and join in the discussion?

Jesus' female disciples

Written out of history

wonderoushen  Female  Gwynedd 9-Apr-2018 10:47 Message #4714836
According to a documentry last night, I think they could be right, we know the bible as we know it was heavily edited over the centuries. Mary Madgalene was never refered to as a prostitute until the 6th century and other women in the gospels are glossed over, it would seem that women bank rolled early Christianity and possibly Jesus himself, afterall we hear about him healing and preaching and wandering about, but very little about the practicalities of getting food and shelter.
HonestBob  Male  the Central region 9-Apr-2018 14:58 Message #4714842
"According to a documentry last night, I think they could be right..."

I'm not as sold on it as you are I'm afraid. I honestly tuned in with a very opened mind, willing to listen and learn... I didn't achieve this and I think the whole thing seemed to stink of Feminism!

Two middle aged women, off on an adventure/girls day out, to uncover more oppression of women in history. They are standing on a rocky beach with a washed up pallet in the background, throwing ideas of powerful and rich women at each other, getting more and more excited by the fantasy, using it to fuel them on in their quest.

They then stopped off at an ancient opera theatre, I think that it what it was, to indulge themselves in some juicy gossip, disguising the scandal of Joanna running of with Jesus... I persisted on with the viewing, despite feeling like I was watching Loose Women.

Off they went to a nice wee cafe, where my interest was captured for a few seconds... by a few very sexy, young waitresses! At the cafe they made a bit of a breakthrough when they discovered...something. Off they went to the bottom of a hill, they must have been feeling rather energetic after their lunch, as the hill had tracks going up it, as if a vehicle had been up it at some point, despite driving a Toyota LandCruiser... they decided to walk up the hill... At this point I could stand no more and switched off.

Granted I did not watch it all, from what I did see, it seemed like something I was expecting to see on the new Dr Who. Time traveling feminists go back in time to discover, or to help... something or other.

I might regroup and go back and try to watch more as I was genuinely interested, but I can't help but think it was feminist fiction.
Timmee  Male  Hampshire 9-Apr-2018 16:52 Message #4714856
It's always seemed to me that the authors of The Bible and The Quran werent't that far apart in their world views when it came to women.
Neither was keen on women drivers or equal pay for women in the entertainment or financial service industries.
linxie  Female  Gloucestershire 9-Apr-2018 17:51 Message #4714858
I guess we have to go with the premise that history is his'story' and most of the writings, I believe, were written many moons after the event by men/scribes. Also our JC was a revolutionary and there were quite a few like him...and ...he was the one that made the most noise and made the 'papers' so was written about.
History does have a tendency to keep repeating itself and our male guru's and healers, today, do attract a number of female followers ;-) who fall in love with their leader. They become quite charismatic when they take a spiritual I have 'seen' ...
I guess they all ate and drank quite well as they 'roamed'...but then that wouldn't have been too newsworthy eh?
wonderoushen  Female  Gwynedd 9-Apr-2018 18:39 Message #4714862
Oh dear were they having to good a time for you Bob? What of the evidence they found or were you to busy being distracted by attractive waiting staff in the background to actually take any notice of was actually said?
Eljer  Male  North London 9-Apr-2018 21:00 Message #4714870
I don't reckon the bible, I reckon our god is a alien...
HonestBob  Male  the Central region 10-Apr-2018 09:21 Message #4714897
"Oh dear were they having to good a time for you Bob? "

Well they certainly looked like they enjoyed themselves, nothing wrong with that... Girls just want to have fun, that's all they really waaant

"What of the evidence they found or were you to busy being distracted by attractive waiting staff in the background to actually take any notice of was actually said?"

Well perhaps if they had hired the waiting staff to host the program it may have been watchable... Maybe if the program was more "diverse" I could have stomached it, the two presenters and the narrator were women! :D :D :D

I would take all of what they found with a pinch of salt, again, of what I saw as I couldn't watch it all. I also noticed a washed up pallet in the back ground, not just the talented waitresses. Now one piece of information the program could have shared, that would have been very interesting, and probably captured the nations attention... The name and location of said Cafe!

Was it a one off or will there be a part two next week?
Aely  Female  Hampshire 11-Apr-2018 21:27 Message #4714959
I think the ladies were pushing it a bit with some of the "evidence" they found but the female Bishop was interesting, although not dating from disciple days of course. That women played a significant role in the early church is indisputable. It would have been hard for the average male Jew to accept and acknowledge - and Christianity was originally a Jewish sect before becoming a religion in its own right. Women were only allowed in the outer chambers of the synagogue. It would have been just as hard for the Romans. However, there are odd snippets surviving in the New Testament which point to inclusivity for women in the very early church, if not actually as full-blown disciples in Jesus' merry band of followers.

There is one mention, I can't remember in which book of the NT, possibly one of those supposedly by the misogynistic Paul, where greetings are sent to the leaders of various Christian Churches. One of the names is female. This is explained away as either " he was just saying hi but she wasn't a Church leader" or "that name was also male". On querying the male name theory with a churchman I was told "It had to be used as a male name as women weren't church leaders". Obviously a case of a boy named Sue...
wonderoushen  Female  Gwynedd 12-Apr-2018 11:03 Message #4714977
I agree Aely it did seem a bit thin and I'm sure if they're right there was much more that could be found, were none of the disciples married for example? One of the biggest questions about Jesus being single is that its unlikely he would have been allowed to preach in the temple if he was unmarried, so where's his wife?

I disagreed with them about Constantine bringing a particulalry masculine Christianity to the fore, his mother Helena was instrumental in Christianity's hunt for sites and relics, whether you believe her identifications or not is beside the point here. I think as Christianity became the state religion and started taking over more of the machinery of state and intertwining them thats women women got pushed out, as to the Romans women were in many ways subject to their menfolk.

It was apparently one of the reasons the Irish church was so wrong to Rome when the two encountered each other in the evangelisation of the Saxon kingdoms, the Irish church not only had a different dating system for Easter and different tonsures, they also had double houses of monks and nuns living and working together as a sort of commune and they were often led by a woman.

There have always been exceptions to male rule and against womens ministry, the abbey at Frontrevault where many of the early Plantagenets are buried had a ruling Abbess as did its daughter houses. Anchoresses caused a lot of fuss as so many appealed to these holy women for prayers and sought advice from them. Of course its easy to think of nunneries as dumping grounds for inconvienient women, but many provided a real alternative to marriage, a chance of learning and working that wouldn't always have been available to secular women.
rosemarysteel  Female  East Anglia 3-Sep-2018 18:18 Message #4724831
Appreciate your thoughtful responses. Initially found some. In the ministry a bit odd but only because it had been exclusively male
Thanks for your input

Back to top  Back to top

Help with conversations Help with conversations »