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potus and flotus have tested positive for covid,

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Male
capnblackbeard  Male  Hertfordshire
2-Oct-2020 11:22 Message #4793809
i hope they both recover very soon, but i do wonder how this will all pan out ??
Male
Hierophant  Male  East Anglia
2-Oct-2020 11:25 Message #4793810
The Dems are pissed cos that was their "Trump" card if Biden started to wobble... (pun intended)...
Male
fosy  Male  Leicestershire
2-Oct-2020 11:51 Message #4793816
conspiracy theory alert...

as things arnt going well for him trump catches covid to delay election....
Male
Hierophant  Male  East Anglia
2-Oct-2020 11:59 Message #4793817
I saw a bit of GMB online just now, where Kate Garraway asked some actor for his reaction and he said he jumped for joy at the news.
She tried to play it down but they chuckled about it being karma or schadenfreude (if you want to be a pretentious actor), all very distasteful really considering Garraway's husband has been apparently close to death with covid and she has blubbed several times on the programme in recent weeks.
I so hope Trump shakes it off and wins the election.....
Female
LadyVera  Female  Cumbria
2-Oct-2020 14:04 Message #4793831
Some people are callous and say atrocious things. The acting fraternity have always been a bit silly in that respect but MPs such as Kate Green have said similar comments.
Female
Aely  Female  Hampshire
2-Oct-2020 15:01 Message #4793836
In the words of the Sergeant Major in It Ain't 'Alf Hot Mum (70s comedy) "Oh dear, what a shame, never mind". He was asking for it. In his own words - "It is what it is". Perhaps he will take it more seriously in future.
Female
wonderoushen  Female  Gwynedd
2-Oct-2020 18:50 Message #4793863
If Trump wins the election but can't take up the post dosen't the vice president take over? That would be Republican Mike Pense, I guess that he would become the Republican nominee if Trump died from it before the election.

I guess some of the news networks feel they've had a reprieve as Trump won't be having any live debates for a few weeks and they won't have to come up with ways to stop him talking all the time.
Female
Aely  Female  Hampshire
2-Oct-2020 19:23 Message #4793867
Pence might be an improvement on the current candidate.
Male
Kimjongun  Male  South Yorkshire
2-Oct-2020 20:47 Message #4793873
I agree with Fosy.
Nothing straight forward with Trump, when he visit me, 2 towels went missing from bathroom.
He also leave hair everywhere he sat, like ginger cat.

He not have Covid, he play games.
Male
FirmButFair-TrollPatrol  Male  North Yorkshire
2-Oct-2020 22:06 Message #4793880
I hate to say it but I don't see anyone of either party in the US who I feel would be any better as President than Trump.
Male
Kimjongun  Male  South Yorkshire
2-Oct-2020 23:28 Message #4793886
He airlifted to hospital now.
Hopefully just precautionary.
That man with dyed hair say, bbc correspondent.
He called John Sopel, might be syrup too.
Female
wonderoushen  Female  Gwynedd
3-Oct-2020 12:27 Message #4793926
I don't think Pence would be much of an improvement to be honest, this is a man who thinks gay people should be killed, that would put him up there with all the other totalitarian leaders of rogue states.
Male
Jeff  Male  East Sussex
9-Oct-2020 19:37 Message #4794618
As an avid Trump watcher, here are some points about his illness that came to my mind, which I then checked for some details. I ask questions, on whose answers I have opinions but I welcome answers from Trump supporters.
I'm not being sarcastic, and as usual, if I have stated anything factually false, then please correct me.

I admire Donald Trump for his physical strength and his willingness to get over having Covid-19. But can one judge the health of the population from one man? I also admire Trump for continually expressing his thoughts in tweets & statements & interviews. But as usual much of what he says and writes is lies. Can one trust what he says about public health?

a. So far in the US there have been more than 7,500,000 Coronavirus cases and over 210,000 deaths officially assigned to it. Since 26-Jun-20 most days have had more than 40,000 new cases per day, and in the past week 45,200. Yet Trump and his associates keep suggesting that the pandemic is nearly ended in the US thanks to them. And on 21-Sep-20 he said "We've done a phenomenal job. Not just a good job, a phenomenal job. Other than public relations, but that's because I have fake news. On public relations, I give myself a D. On the job itself, we take an A+". Even though it was started in China, has Trump done a phenomenal A+ job in trying to reduce its spread?
Male
Jeff  Male  East Sussex
9-Oct-2020 19:39 Message #4794619
b. Trump has very often referred to his China travel ban on 02-Feb-20, but he still allowed 40,000 Americans in the next 2 months, and more than that number of foreigners (without much screening), to come direct from China, and there was then no ban from Hong Kong & Macau which had cases.
The Cato Institute is the 10th top think tank in the US, it calls for lowering or abolishing most taxes, and much privatisation, and its website includes "dedicated to the principles of individual liberty, limited government, free markets", so it is very much on Trump's side. On 08-Jun-20 its working paper which near the start said "Historically, travel restrictions to prevent the spread of pandemic influenzas have been ine ective at halting or significantly delaying the spread (WHO Writing Group, 2006)". Cato's conclusion included "The travel restrictions had no effect on the number of COVID-19 cases in the United States. Regardless of the intervention date or how the spread of COVID-19 is measured, we find that the travel restrictions did not delay the prevalence of COVID-19 in the United States." Should Trump continue to boast about his "ban" on travel from China?

c. On 6 October after leaving hospital, Trump said "I knew there's danger to it - but I had to do it. I stood out front. I led. Nobody that's a leader would not do what I did. And I know there's a risk, there's a danger -- but that's okay". That suggests that he deliberately sacrificed himself. He repeatedly compares himself to Abraham Lincoln and Winston Churchill, giving false statements about them. Is it better to lead civilians into grave danger, or to lead them in ways (e.g. masks & social distancing) that try to avoid danger?

d. In the White House Trump greatly discouraged wearing of masks. In public he has repeatedly mocked people for wearing them, including Joe Biden in the debate on 29 September. At that debate, most of his family broke the rules and removed their masks. Should relatives of the president be exempt from rules that try to protect them and other people? On 7 October a leaked internal memo said that Coronavirus has infected "34 White House staffers and other contacts". Still on 7 October White House aides were near each other without masks. Should people who know health risks to other people, ignore them?

Male
Jeff  Male  East Sussex
9-Oct-2020 19:41 Message #4794620
e. Trump's doctors have records of when he last tested negative for Covid-19, but they and White House staff and Trump himself persistently refuse to answer questions when that was. Isn't the date & time of the last negative test result useful to try to trace who else could be in danger? Trump didn't inform Biden when he tweeted that he was infected, only 3 days after their debate. Trump's doctors and staff gave inconsistent reports about the severity of his illness, and have refused to answer related questions. Does that indicate truthfulness? White House physician Sean Conley said "I didn't want to give any information that might steer the course of illness in another direction". Could giving information make the illness worse for Trump? Could giving information be useful for other people?

f. Trump insisted on leaving hospital despite his doctors saying he "may not be out of the woods yet" and could still be infectious. Soon after that he went on a trip in a car just to wave to his supporters. The at least 3 other people in that car, who presumably didn't have Covid-19 before the trip, should then go into quarantine. Was that car trip worthwhile? Trump had coughed (a Covid-19 symptom) and muted his microphone repeatedly in a phone interview on 8 October night. He wants to have a rally in Florida as soon as 10 October, and one in Pennsylvania the following day. Is that wise for him? At many of his rallies his supporters have not worn masks and not socially distanced, and even the outdoor rallies have had some functions indoors. Is that wise for their health?

g. The 2nd debate between Trump and Biden was scheduled for 15 October. The non-partisan Commission on Presidential Debates announced "from separate remote locations... to protect the health and safety of all involved". But Trump refuses to do that, saying "I’m not going to waste my time doing a virtual debate. ... You sit behind a computer and do a debate - it’s ridiculous, and then they cut you off whenever they want." Is it good to enforce non-interruption rules that both sides have agreed on? Yet most news events have reports from people outside the studio, and on 13 October 1960 (which is 60 years ago) the televised presidential debate was between John Kennedy in New York and Richard Nixon 3,000 miles away in California with the moderator in Chicago. Why not have the next debate done remotely, to avoid risking the health of many people?
Male
Jeff  Male  East Sussex
9-Oct-2020 19:46 Message #4794621
h. Trump had a wide variety of treatments from about 13 doctors, including possibly among the best in the country. Do many people have those treatments and doctors? He had Regeneron's REGN-COV2, ("I went in, I wasn't feeling so hot, and within a very short period of time, they gave me Regeneron. It's called Regeneron. And other things, too, but I think this was the key. But they gave me Regeneron. And it was, like, unbelievable. I felt good immediately ... I heard about this drug. I said 'Let me take it'. It was my suggestion. I said 'Let me take it'." As Trump had a mixture of treatments, does an immediate feeling good from one show that it was that treatment that did the "cure"? Trump said "They call them therapeutic, but to me, it wasn't therapeutic. It just made me better. OK? I call that a cure." Is therapeutic the same as a cure?
Regeneron's CEO Leonard Schleifer is a friend ("Lenny") and golfing buddy of Trump. Might that have influenced Trump's request and his recommending it? The first bulk buy cost $1,500 per dose. Although it is insufficiently tested, Trump says that he wants to give it free to every American hospital having severe Covid-19 cases. If it is found not to work well or has bad side effects, people who voted for Trump on that basis cannot cancel their votes. Should treatments be released before enough testing, (as determined by medical and statistical experts)?

i. Trump is currently fighting the Affordable Care Act (ACA, Obamacare) which will go to the Supreme Court, and his new nominee Amy Coney Barrett has repeatedly opposed the ACA. Does Trump want poorer people to have affordable healthcare? Practically his first action on becoming president was to try to get rid of Obamacare, promising he has a better plan, (including fairness for people having pre-existing conditions), but despite many requests by others and promises by him, 4 years later he still hasn't detailed his plan. Is it good to remove one plan before offering a detailed replacement?
Female
NoSaint  Female  Devon
9-Oct-2020 22:30 Message #4794634
I also watch US politics and I see nobody in any party who would be an obvious improvement on Trump.
Male
HotOrWot  Male  Lancashire
10-Oct-2020 07:38 Message #4794658
I also watch US politics and I see nobody in any party who would be an obvious improvement on Trump.

Trump worries many countries because he stands for loyalty and patriotism to the United States and has little time for globalism.
Male
Hierophant  Male  East Anglia
10-Oct-2020 07:41 Message #4794661
Christ Jeff, you must be full of mixed emotions, you want Biden to win, yet if he does and Trump is no more, your life will no longer have any purpose...
Male
Hierophant  Male  East Anglia
10-Oct-2020 09:37 Message #4794685
Jesus, the American election just got even more bonkers as Nancy Pelosi has introduced legislation that would create a bipartisan group of outside experts to evaluate President Trump’s mental and physical health and advise Congress whether his powers should be forcibly removed under the 25th Amendment.
Of course, if this passes (which it probably won't) it wouldn't just apply to Trump, but to every future President.

All very odd considering we are told Biden has this election in the bag.
Or maybe, here's a conspiracy theory for you, this is all aimed at removing Biden "nicely" after he wins and replacing him with Kamala Harris.
Suddenly, the USA has it's first female President, and a black one at that, all above board although through the back door.

Americans clearly have a problem voting for a female President in her own right, so this could be a way round it.
Give people what they want, the familiar old white male and then move the chairs a bit - old sleepy Joe is the Trojan horse, I wonder if he realises?....
Female
wonderoushen  Female  Gwynedd
10-Oct-2020 11:57 Message #4794698
Its not just about Trump as theres not enough time to get the legislation through before the election, its about what happens in the future if a president becomes incapacitated. But I do agree that it looks aimed at Trump and I think its a very unwise move on the Democrat side to do something that looks like attacking a president this close to an election, I think this could be the thing that loses the democrats the election.

I watch the news and news coming from America and its like some dystopian film or tv series. Trump's ignoring all the warnings about covid even though theres been a superpsreader event at the Whitehouse. He's barely a week from diagnosis and being taken to hospital and he's off doing rally's where there will be no masks or social distancing and nobody even knows if Trump is still infectious. I've got to be honest I'm not even sure if I believe he ever had the virus and its all a publicity stunt, or if he's on such a strong dose of steroids he feels invinceble and is brewing a massive heart attack or something.

What is it with Mike Pence's hair? It looked like it was emulsioned to his head so much so that he didn't feel a fly land on him. Isn't a fly a symbol of the devil or something?
Male
Jeff  Male  East Sussex
10-Oct-2020 12:47 Message #4794702
Hierophant,
I do have a number of other interests. For example, see thread "Life long learning University level" http://www.midsummerseve.com/fora/thread.aspx?threadid=194519&page=1 on 03-Oct-20 at 20:14 & 21-09. There's also religion, science, magic, various topics in MSE some of which I spend hours researching (e.g. many posts in thread "Family Dynasties" http://www.midsummerseve.com/fora/thread.aspx?threadid=194447&page=1), etc.
But I would prefer to discuss the topics that I raise, and have some answers from Trump supporters, rather than comments about myself.
WH could look up the 1965 25th Amendment to the US Constitution that you mentioned. (WH = Wonderoushen, the WH White House already knows it.)


j. On 9 October Donald Trump said "I think the secret for me was I got there very early ... I think going in early is a big factor in my case. ... I didn't have a problem with breathing, which a lot of people seem to have. I had none of that, but I didn't feel very strong. I didn't feel very vital." Does that increase or decrease the evidence that Regeneron's treatment was what caused him to be "cured"? How many Americans can afford to go to a doctor because they don't feel very strong or vital?

k. Not only do Trump & his doctors & staff refuse to say when he was last tested negative before the 29 September debate, thus possibly endangering people who got near him (see paragraph f), but they still refuse to answer when he last tested negative. For example, on 9 October on Fox News in a phoned interview with Fox News' Sean Hannity:-
Hannity: "Have you been tested recently?"
Trump: "Fortunately, the - yes, I just saw the doctors today. They think I'm in great shape. I'm in great shape."
Hannity: "Did you test negative?"
Trump: "I know when I'm in good shape or not. And I will tell you, I took this Regeneron. It's phenomenal. And Eli Lilly has something very comparable. It's phenomenal. ..."
Hannity: "Have you had a test since your diagnosis a week ago?"
Trump: "Well, what we're doing is probably the test will be tomorrow, the actual test, because there's no reason to test all the time. But they found very little infection or virus, if any. I don't know that they found any."

Trump also said "I think I'm the most analyzed human being in the world right now", which is roughly true.
Wouldn't Trump have had many tests for Covid-19 since he left hospital on 6 October? If their results were negative, wouldn't he and his doctors been proud to say so repeatedly very clearly, to confirm his claim that he has been cured? Doesn't their not doing so indicate that the results were positive, so he hasn't been cured or at least it isn't certain, so his claims are false?
Top infectious disease expert Dr. Anthony Fauci, who isn't directly involved with Trump in his illness, has said that two negative lab tests for Covid-19 24 hours apart are a key factor to determine if someone is still contagious.
Does this indicate that Trump's intentions to hold rallies starting 12 October is risking the lives of his supporters and people near him?
Male
Hierophant  Male  East Anglia
10-Oct-2020 13:20 Message #4794703
"I think this could be the thing that loses the democrats the election."

You might be right, it seems odd for a party that are apparently way ahead in the polls to try to do something like this at such a late stage.
They failed to impeach Trump so they thought they would bring in new legislation.
Still, it's exactly 4 years ago today that Hilary Clinton was 14 points ahead of Trump in the polls and we all know how that turned out.
Maybe history is about to repeat itself, I do hope so...
Male
Templar2013  Male  South East London
10-Oct-2020 17:17 Message #4794710
I have friends in America and Trump is far more popular there than the press would have us believe. Most Americans you speak to including those who want to get rid of Trump find it difficult to find serious fault in what he has actually done. The criticisms are directed at what might happen and what he might do.
Male
Hierophant  Male  East Anglia
10-Oct-2020 19:12 Message #4794720
I agree, it's also the reason why so many Trump supporters are what is known as "shy" voters, and won't declare their true intentions when asked by pollsters.
In the voting booth it's just you and that bit of paper...

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