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Rape law changes

terry  Male  West Yorkshire
12-Sep-2020 18:51 Message #4792144
Not sure if they've passed it yet, but Nigeria is looking at using castration as a punishment for child rape and the rape of a woman (not sure if they regard the rape of men in the same way?).

Just wondered if anyone has any thoughts on the subject in general, not just in Nigeria?
HonestBob  Male  the Central region
12-Sep-2020 19:37 Message #4792148
I think it's a fitting punishment.... Well done Nigeria!

Just one thing though....

What happens when a woman says she was raped, then the man gets castrated.... then we find out she was a lying, conniving piece of shit?

Does she then have her reproductive rights removed? Or do they do what the do in this country and go "Oh well!"

Another thought....

If a woman says a man raped her, but he wasn't even in the country.... Does making a false rape allegation carry as befitting a punishment as rape? for example.... If she claims I raped her, but before my testicles were removed by a blunt machete, it gets proven I didn't do it.... Do the same people get to hack out her ovaries? After all, she was willing me to be mutated.

In general I thing the punishment for rape is too short, and I think the punishment for false rape allegations should hold the same punishment as rape.

I heard of a young man, down the south of England.... hung himself because he was falsely accused of rape! Poor boy ended it all.

"The girl dropped the charges after two weeks but by then Jay, who was described as a 'gentleman' and 'intelligent', had already 'spiralled completely'.'I don't think I've ever really seen a boy bellow and cry and just be as distraught as he was,' his older sister Camellia says"

I'll link the story below.

For anyone who thinks we live in a "rape culture" tell that to this boys family!

If I was in charge all the rapists would be locked up, for minimum of 20 years. Any woman caught lying about being raped.... she would be in the same prison as the rapists for a week.... maybe then she would have appreciation and sympathy for the women who really have had their lives ruined by a monster.
HonestBob  Male  the Central region
12-Sep-2020 19:38 Message #4792149
NoSaint  Female  Devon
12-Sep-2020 22:51 Message #4792156
Gut feeling might be "chop them off" but it's a similar situation to the death penalty. Mistakes are made and some things cannot be reversed. Morally it must be wrong too.
Minnie-the-Minx  Female  Hertfordshire
13-Sep-2020 09:30 Message #4792178
Well, I can see why rape of men might not be included. There are no legal LGBT rights whatsoever in Nigeria. Officially, homosexuality does not exist, so logically there would be no need to legislate against "something that doesn't happen" apparently.
And the fact that homosexuality wasn't decriminalised in this country until 1967 tells you a lot about why it was so difficult to achieve recognition of male on male rape as a crime here.
The Nigerian situation regarding rape is part of a movement throughout Africa that has been very slow to gain any kind of momentum, but is very gradually gathering some speed. Historically, rape has been a huge problem in Africa. In most African countries the victim was unlikely to have been believed and there was no process for finding and punishing the perpetrator. Women keep quiet if it happens to them and they are stigmatised and ostracised, if a pregnancy results. A number of countries have recently made moves to increase protection for women, but there is still a very long way to go.
I think it is worthwhile, considering how rape has been seen historically in the UK. Even here, a woman could not take any legal action against being raped, only the crown or the woman's legal guardians. It was considered to be more of a theft from the guardian or the crown, rather than a violent assault against the woman that it happened to. And even nowadays, the words that are used to discuss rape tells you a lot. There are discussions on how to stop women being raped, like it is a woman's responsibility to not allow herself to be raped. Historically, the focus has always been on what she was wearing, was she out after dark, had she had sex before and who with? Whilst I would not discourage any woman from being streetwise and taking reasonable steps for her own safety, it should not be the responsibility of women to change their behaviour to prevent men doing stupid and criminal things. The real responsibility lies with the perpetrator. The fact is that some men rape. How do we stop them doing that?
Minnie-the-Minx  Female  Hertfordshire
13-Sep-2020 11:17 Message #4792202
And I really don't think that castration is the right way to go. It won't act as a deterrent. All it means is that the perpetrator has to be more cunning about not being detected or the person that they rape does not report it. Increasing the stakes of what has previously been a very low risk crime for the rapist has the potential to increase the chances of murder as a way of ensuring that they get away with it.
In countries where the incidence of rape is very high, a massive cultural shift needs to take place, and the main way that I see for tackling this would include addressing the sense of entitlement that the men in those cultures have over women. Rape has to be seen for what it is; a means of exercising and acting out control and power and very little about the rapist being temporarily overcome by their sexual desires.
wonderoushen  Female  Gwynedd
13-Sep-2020 11:46 Message #4792209
I agree with both your posts Minnie, I would add that I think it makes murder more likely, the best way to stop a woman talking about rape is to kill her. I don't beliee rape is about sex, but about power and the weaponisation of sex, if the "weapon" is removed it won't stop the psychological drivers. I think it might make some use other objects to sexually abuse women, such as sticks and bottles, then whats the punishment where does it end?
Kimjongun  Male  South Yorkshire
13-Sep-2020 19:19 Message #4792238
It happened already Honest Bob.

Man castrated by gang of women, cos he rape woman.

Later woman say she only say he raped her.

Because she fancied him, and thought it would create contact!

It long time ago, somewhere in East Europe.
HonestBob  Male  the Central region
13-Sep-2020 22:37 Message #4792245
"It happened already Honest Bob."

It happens a lot....

Didn't a politician commit suicide in the last few years due to a false rape allegation?

There was another in Russia, A girl accused a man of molesting her, her Father and friends beat him to death. The little girl admitted to making it up... Man dead, father in prison!

Have you heard of Mattress Girl? or The Duke Lacrosse team accusations? Or How about the British girl who lied about being Gang Raped in Ayia Napa by guys from.... Some where Arab or African.... I forget where.

Then we have the string of false accusations like the Bret Kavanaugh thing.
Hierophant  Male  East Anglia
14-Sep-2020 11:16 Message #4792285
"Rape has to be seen for what it is; a means of exercising and acting out control and power and very little about the rapist being temporarily overcome by their sexual desires."

At the risk of sounding pedantic or confrontational, unless you're a male I don't think you will really understand what drives a male to rape.
Power and control undoubtedly is part of it, but sudden sexual desire is also a large factor I would suggest....
wonderoushen  Female  Gwynedd
14-Sep-2020 18:57 Message #4792314
Heiro, would add very poor impulse control too, if its a sudden sexual desire? I mean millions of men around the world must experience sudden sexual desire everyday, especially when adolescent, but most have the ability to control thier impulses or every man would be a rapist and I don't believe that.
persona_non_grata  Male  North London
15-Sep-2020 17:45 Message #4792389
I don't think there is any doubt that men's sexual desires are entirely different to those of a woman and the power thing might be a factor (I'm no psychiatrist) but I do think it is mainly the sexual desires that drive a man to commit such offences.

I would support any measures which were fair and led to the conviction of more rapists. In some parts of the world it is accepted as a normal part of life and women don't even reach being second class citizens. It makes me angry wherever it happens but I don't think there will be many changes in countries that do not have organised law and order.
We should be able to do more for women in the UK but the big fear is false accusation and wrongful convictions unless there are independent witnesses or cctv evidence.
wonderoushen  Female  Gwynedd
15-Sep-2020 18:51 Message #4792396
And there lies the problem, even in stranger rape, the classic dagged down an alley stuff, predators often know where cctv cameras are and are forensically aware, even to the point of making thier victims wash in bleachy water to destroy trace evidence, DNA etc if they're in a house or hotel. When its someone known to the victim its even harder to prove and often the victim is treated as a suspect.

png, why do you think its mainly sexual desire rather than a need to dominate, have power and control thats the biggest driver for rape? I'm genuinely interested to have a male perspective on this aspect.
Colonel_Blink  Male  Buckinghamshire
16-Sep-2020 07:46 Message #4792415
Some countries are a law unto themselves and governments do whatever they wish regardless of fairness or evidence and I would be worried if accused of even minor misdemeanours in those countries.
If a convicted rapist who accepts their guilt is given the opportunity to be given voluntary castration perhaps it would be a worthwhile experiment.

Hierophant  Male  East Anglia
16-Sep-2020 08:08 Message #4792417
"why do you think its mainly sexual desire rather than a need to dominate, have power and control thats the biggest driver for rape?"

Because most men are programmed that way.
Blimey I remember when I was younger I would get turned on by the slightest thing, of course that doesn't mean all males are one step away from raping someone, but for some if the opportunity presents itself they will find it hard to resist.
Most males deal with their sexual desire themselves, but some will become obsessed with a person they see regularly such as a relative or person they work with.

I think rape of someone the perpetrator knows is far more common than the rape of a complete stranger. The desire builds up over time, but I think it's simply about wanting to have sex with someone you would never get with in normal circumstances.
Of course by raping someone you are naturally dominating and controlling them, but I think that's a consequence rather than a driver.
That's my view anyway...
HonestBob  Male  the Central region
16-Sep-2020 08:52 Message #4792418
" why do you think its mainly sexual desire rather than a need to dominate, have power and control thats the biggest driver for rape? I'm genuinely interested to have a male perspective on this aspect."

Maybe they are both linked? Maybe a mans sexual desire is to dominate and when he rapes... its a issue of dominance? Maybe. Thing is WH, and I think it's a mistake you make.... You can ask a man anything you want about rape, who you need to ask is a rapist, not all men are rapists.

I could speculate as to why a man rapes a woman, but that is all it would be.... as I'm not a rapist.

Could it be that a man cannot control his impulses? Possibly.... But in that case, I was walking through a door way into a shop last year (before masks of compliance) as I opened the door a woman was coming out. She was about 20 years old, blonde hair, very....very petite and she had a very reveling top on. She looked a million dollars! Her chest, and I do mean her chest, not tits, although her tits were marvelous, her chest as in the section between her tits and throat.... it was incredible! The tan, the shine, her skin was just incredible. Just one of these people that stop you in your tracks and spark an immense sexual attraction. I saw her for about 2 seconds maximum! I still can see her in my mind a year later. Could I have pushed her against the door and had my way with her? Yes! easily! Why didn't I? I have terrible self control, although it is getting better, I can't have crisps, biscuits or cakes in my house or I scoff them all..... I think if it was poor self control or impulses, you would see much more rapes in door way, in the street, on the bus ect....

Dominance?..... Majority of men are perfectly capable of dominating a woman, with ease! It's pretty much fact! I've been described as dominant before by certain women. Do I like to dominate a woman sexually? Yes! Do women like to be dominated sexually? YES!!!.... So dominance is there, but I don't think its it!

The opportunist? A guy finds a strong, empowered, modern woman passed out drunk as a skunk. She is wearing a skirt, that is now over her waist, the small piece of dental floss she calls underwear, isn't covering nothing.... The opportunist looks around, does a risk assessment.... decides to get a freeby!

Now my pick is.... Sexual frustration!

Now in countries, whether it be now, or in the past, where a man could have 3-4-5 wives... If one wealthy man could have five women, it leaves four men with no women. From what I hear, and I have no stats or what ever to back it up, where this happens the rape and rape of children is higher. I heard stories from Pakistan or India of the high number of young boys who get raped. If the men who are one of the men who can't get a wife, because Mr Tall n Rich have multiple wifes, and they don't live in a society like ours where women are.... slutty for lack of a better word.... I could see that being a driving factor.

You hear about men like Cristiano Ronaldo being accused of rape.... I think to myself.... He could do any thing, with just about any woman he desires.... Is he/does he really need to force a woman to do anything?

Do you think if you took a rapist, lets say there is a guy who is going to go out on Saturday night and drag a woman into an alley and rape her, that is what he is going to do on Saturday night. Do you think that if..... Britney Spears knocked his door on Saturday afternoon and asked him for a sex session, and he accepted..... Do you think he would still go our raping that night? personally I think her would take a week off! Or indeed the above mentioned opportunist, would he take a freeby is he had had sex that afternoon?

Can I also take this opportunity to mention the sexual assault and rape rate that go through the roof when migrants attended a new years party in Germany.... was it 1200-1400 women reported to have been sexually assaulted by migrants in one night?

Then we have th
persona_non_grata  Male  North London
16-Sep-2020 18:40 Message #4792473
Wonderoushen I so wish I had a brilliant and enlightening answer but sadly I do not. I have my own judgement and theories just from life experiences.
I have dated two girls who had been raped and talked at length on the subject. I knew a guy (almost a friend at one time) who raped a girl we both knew and went to prison for it. Later he raped and murdered at least one prostitute. I also worked in the relocation of vulnerable women into refuges and some rapes were part of the offences involved although most were just physical violence. So I've seen a lot of it but definitely no expert.
I think that those who go out to commit multiple rapes are driven by power and the urge to subdue the victim whereas those who commit "spur of the moment, opportunist" rapes are more likely driven by sexual drives and probably drink too.
wonderoushen  Female  Gwynedd
16-Sep-2020 18:50 Message #4792475
png, you could be right about opportunist rapes, I'm no expert either, but then are any of us? If peoples inhibitions are lowered by alcohol (or drugs) as is generally accepted then I can see how one could lose impulse control too.

Bob, Many men could physically over power a woman, or another man for that matter, but most men find that sort of thing abhorrent and rightly so. Just because you could do something dosen't mean you can or will and are constantly having to stop yourself from acting upon that ability. Most men, and women, have enough control over thier impulses not to sexually assault or rape another person even if they feel they're physically strong enough. That you saw a woman and thought PHWOAR dosen't make you a bad person, nor does fantasising about her.
HonestBob  Male  the Central region
17-Sep-2020 12:00 Message #4792547
"That you saw a woman and thought PHWOAR dosen't make you a bad person, nor does fantasising about her."

Yes.... I think you missed my point.

So WH what about the sexual frustration theory?
wonderoushen  Female  Gwynedd
17-Sep-2020 19:11 Message #4792573
I think there are plenty of other ways to deal with sexual frustration than rape and whilst I could see that the odd rapist may have this as a driver I doubt if its a common one. I'm sure many of us have been seriously sexually frustrated at times but have never thought of rape as the answer, I'd suspect that sexual frustration would be accompanied by other things such as a wish for dominance, poor impulse control etc. I didn't miss your point, I choose to engage with it differently as I have no wish to engage in a discussion about how women dress etc, thats old ground and we don't agree and probably won't agree even if we sat here arguing for a couple of decades.
Beach  Male  Dorset
17-Sep-2020 20:44 Message #4792574
The constant mantra of claiming men can’t control their libido never ceases, does it? I find the generalised label highly offensive and tedious. Likewise, not all of us wish to push our dicks into anything horizontal and breathing and not all of us react so predictably when sex is offered to us easily either.

I always valued myself as someone worth investing in romantically and used to make a joke of females coming on too strong by saying something like, ”You’ll have to work harder than that to get me into bed.”

And no. I was never a prude or shy in that department, (the opposite in fact), but I learned a very long time ago that some things become even more desirable when presented as unattainable or aloof and that was, generally, the philosophy I applied with any potential new relationship.

UK Rape Law Changes

The male rape thing is worth commenting on again.

I’ve told you people this story before but … well … around a dozen years ago, I made a new female friend. A P.A for a famous celebrity chef.

She was no oil painting, sort of plain without a particularly stunning figure … but she was a friend ...and yes, for several months, maybe a year prior, I had merely tolerated her flirting with me but one day she invited me to her massive birthday party along with my son and his friends and some of her big shot friends. Guest list was 100+ and I had a good time except …

The next thing I knew, I was waking up at about 5am with this woman animated and astride me; in my own bed back at home.

I had no clue or memory of how or when I would have returned that night but there she was, naked and on top of me.

I halted the liaison there and then and told her to go home and never really compartmentalized what must have happened to me until a change to the UK rape law with regards to alcohol and consent which appeared all over the papers several months later.

Seeing things in black and white in the papers and listening to pundits and commentators on TV profoundly affect me and from that day to this, my whole outlook on meeting, dating and making love to other girls / women was never ever the same again.

I can’t say I felt violated or embarrassed or psychologically wounded on a conscious level or anything but on the very rare occasions I’ve seen the person again, it has taken all of my willpower and discipline to just grit my teeth in her company rather than make some scene or even discuss the incident.

I thought that perhaps, one day, I’d laugh about it and simply add it to a list of funny adventures I might have recalled and laughed about with friends - but that day has never come.

My son knows about it and, really, the only hurt I can associate with the whole thing is the hurt I saw in his eyes when I told him about it.
Colonel_Blink  Male  Buckinghamshire
17-Sep-2020 21:37 Message #4792578
I honestly couldn't say whether rapists commit their crime due to sexual drive or a power drive and I would probably agree with others that it is a bit of both.

Obviously not all men are the same but the male sexual drive is a very strong thing that many struggle to control which is why you get so many cases of date rape where things have gone past the point of no return for the male while the female has wanted to stop or changed her mind and has no trouble stopping.
HotOrWot  Male  Lancashire
18-Sep-2020 07:55 Message #4792603
Interesting post png.

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