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To recognize the suffering of others

Witheflow  Male  North Yorkshire
3-Oct-2019 20:16 Message #4755995
Is the feeling of distress and pity for the suffering or misfortune of another, learnt or something deeper?
JustLyn  Female  Cheshire
3-Oct-2019 21:31 Message #4756012
I think its deeper, but some can feign it and appear to care, or even know its wrong not to care and still choose to care even if they dont truly feel it.

I sometimes feel aloof, disconected, then realise i'm not because the pain of others can cause me to cry with them. At work it can be embarrassing.

Maybe some keeps their distance from caring too much because they don"t like how it feels.
Aely  Female  Hampshire
3-Oct-2019 22:50 Message #4756032
It is hard to feel compassion but feel powerless to help. I pretty much agree with everything Lyn has just said.

Sociopaths are incapable of feeling compassion but apparently they make excellent business managers. They care about nobody but themselves. Thankfully most people aren't sociopaths.
Witheflow  Male  North Yorkshire
3-Oct-2019 23:43 Message #4756050
I agree Lyn. It is deeper i feel. Morals are taught in religious schools but, some get through with little compassion for others. Faking compassion is a sociopath trait. But then can not one ask, are sociopaths uncompassionate from their upbringing. Early and secondary socialisation etc? There is a Chinese belief that all children are uncarved blocks. Like a piece of wood and, they become shaped by their environment and personal interactions.

Aloofness is like feeling along amongst a crowd of people and not getting the vibe. Or not adhering to the flow that's emitting. Feeling someones pain is empathy. And to possess that gift is to be proud. I totally felt your explanation of crying with others and feeling it deeply. That wasn't taught, that's from somewhere special.

Maybe some keep their distance, because they have been hoodwinked by a few too many sociopaths. It can work both ways.
Michaelt  Male  Devon
4-Oct-2019 09:50 Message #4756095
Witheflow, An excellent posting, but I would challenge you and say that some people, out in the big wide world, and here on this site, , just dont care. They lack empathy., they have neither compassion , or understanding.....They are content in their own little bubbles....
Michaelt  Male  Devon
4-Oct-2019 14:51 Message #4756140
JustLyn , I dont think people can switch off how they feel, I certainly can't.
JustLyn  Female  Cheshire
4-Oct-2019 15:09 Message #4756147

It isn't switching off as such, but distancing for a while. Not focusing on the issue, distracting so the thoughts are diverted.

You'd have to do it if confronted by a major car accident. It doesn't stop you recognising the consequences, but to take action, you might need to step back emotionally to deal with certain sights and situations.
Michaelt  Male  Devon
4-Oct-2019 16:03 Message #4756166
JustLyn, Im not talking about road/vehicle accidents hurting people, im talking about the suffering of people under this Tory Government.

I got involved the 80's because I just could not walk by on the other side of the road so to speak, I hate injustice of any kind, unfortunately there are so many people who are able to walk by on the other side of the road. It is unbelievable...
JustLyn  Female  Cheshire
4-Oct-2019 19:08 Message #4756197

I agree with you on that, but there's the people who get it and yet see other priorities because it affects their own life. Then there's the one's who don't see it or believe it and in a way, they are not as bad because if they are ignorant and blind, it might not actually be their fault.

If I was younger, and had not so many battles yet to fight for my children, I might have taken a different path, but I didn't have any confidence back then and I cannot change that at this stage.

However, on Monday wk next I am at a Labour meeting, had a personal call asking me to go from my MP, and even though he is Labour, they can only operate by keep nudging change and many Conservative MPs are also uncomfortable with the situation, like Rory Stewart which is probably why Johnson kicked him out, not just Brexit, an excuse to get rid of what he sees is the deadwood. I hope it comes back to bite him.

I don't always manage it, but sometimes, to protect one's mental health, it is necessary to detach a while and step back. It doesn't mean the fight has stopped, but in battle terms I guess it is regrouping the internal army, healing, ready for the next onslaught. I am on leave most of next week but Thursday I am in court, with my son, fighting the system that is getting it wrong s often for so many, but it is costing on a no win no fee basis to employ a solicitor to represent my son because if family try it, it is assumed one s trying to fiddle the system and complicit with a false claim. In many ways, the vulnerable in our society are being treated with less understanding than criminals.
Aely  Female  Hampshire
4-Oct-2019 21:07 Message #4756222
Easier targets, Lyn.
Withgoodintent  Male  North Yorkshire
4-Oct-2019 22:58 Message #4756255
Michaelt. Why did you wait until the 80’s to get involved. Were you blind to the 70’s?
Michaelt  Male  Devon
5-Oct-2019 08:42 Message #4756297
Withgoodintent, I hated Thatcher's right wing policies. My personal life was in upheaval in the late 70's. I could only get involved from the early 80's. Does that answer your question ?
Michaelt  Male  Devon
5-Oct-2019 08:45 Message #4756298
JustLyn, ""it is assumed one s trying to fiddle the system and complicit with a false claim".. This is a major problem with so many Brit's. Small minded, which suits the Tories, and the right wing press who feed off it....
Michaelt  Male  Devon
5-Oct-2019 13:51 Message #4756325
JustLyn, You come across as having tremendous empathy. My late wife was like that, she had loads of empathy.

Good2BWith  Male  West Yorkshire
5-Oct-2019 23:33 Message #4756407
I'm pleased to see that the discussion has moved away from "Sociopaths".
IMO, it is far too easy a way of dumping the problem of the dis-functionality of UK society on a group of individuals one can label as Sociopaths.

Not long ago I attended the cremation and Wake for a very good comrade who I had worked alongside for many years before we both retired.

At the Wake, I was approached by a now retired Senior Manager.
Whilst constantly proclaiming their Leftist politics, being a Magistrate etc , this person treated their staff appallingly and acted as Investigator, Judge, Jury and 'Executioner' all in one without forewarning or ability to call even a McKenzie Friend let alone a TU Rep.
I had clashed with this person on such matters on a # of occasions.

They came across the room at the Wake and greeted me as if I had been a long-lost life-time friend.
The broadside I fired was unremitting.

The only reply was the Nurenberg Defence.

Such people are well aware of that which they do and why it is done.

A re-reading of: Berne's Wooden Leg may be useful.
Witheflow  Male  North Yorkshire
6-Oct-2019 13:25 Message #4756508
You honoured your friend well Good2Bwith. I agree it is too easy to label selfishness but, if not nurture that clouds our humanity, what form of nature do you propose drives the act of selfishness? Eric Bernes wooden leg thesis focuses on excuse postering. Proclaiming insanity or ignorance, isn't enough. But developing in an environment void of compassion, is surely a reason as to why one is blind?

Knowledge is power. Ignorance is bliss. Tough choice
Good2BWith  Male  West Yorkshire
6-Oct-2019 15:20 Message #4756534
Yes, I agree that "Wooden Leg" is not the best approximation.

On the following matters:

1.0 But developing in an environment void of compassion, is surely a reason as to why one is blind?

I recall the work of the much maligned R D Laing who regarded schizophrenia as a theory, not a fact.
A person's environment had been seen as the trigger for the manifestation of an underlying mental disfunction.
Laing stood that orthodoxy on its head and posited that it was the environment, from the cradle onwards, which, offering dissonant messages, forced the recipient's mind into developing coping strategies which were then labelled by mainstream psychiatric practitioners as schizophrenia.
That, in turn, justified incarceration and electric (brain) shock 'treatment'.
This thesis was illustrated in films on BBC TV - The Wednesday Play: In Two Minds (1967) *, and *Family Life (1971) - both directed by Ken Loach

2.0 Knowledge is power. Ignorance is bliss. Tough choice
Where ignorance is bliss, 'tis folly to be wize. Thomas Gray
JustLyn  Female  Cheshire
27-Oct-2019 17:20 Message #4760626
I have not seen the previous Ken Loach films. In fact I hadn't heard of him until I saw the "I, Daniel Blake" film and now a new one coming out on 1st November "Sorry, I Missed You" based on reported experiences of the gig economy, not those who choose it, but those forced into accepting it where no alternative is offered.

Today, on my Facebook News feed from The Disability Service where a disabled MP has been frequently asking the DWP to audit deaths reported as a result of loss of benefits. They keep avoiding the subject I imagine, because of the implications. Part of the text states:

"Four years ago, public health experts from the Universities of Liverpool and Oxford showed in a study that, across England as a whole, the process of reassessing people on incapacity benefit for the new ESA between 2010 and 2013 was “associated with” an extra 590 suicides." ….and that was FOUR years ago!

I don't expect a response from G2BW or Witheflow now but in spite of the strange outpouring of abuse in frustration trying to show their compassion and understanding on subjects such as these, as many others keep denying such facts are actually real.

I hope whatever leader we get in the future that they do learn and care about these longstanding very important issues which to me, are even more important than Brexit and why when we do get to vote, it should be at a time when people's minds are not just thinking of Brexit as if that is all that matters.

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